Random Thoughts…

There is no such thing as joy. There’s no such thing as love. There’s no such thing as happiness, pleasure, heaven, whatever. None of that crap actually exists.

What does actually exist is reality and all the unpleasantness of it. The only things that truly exist are pain, suffering, illness, and misery. To say otherwise is to be completely and totally delusional, yet we’re somehow genetically programmed to continue the cycle of badness and suffering, and what the fuck for?

There is no good in life. There are only differing degrees of bad, so why would you subject new individuals to the badness that is life? To make you feel less bad about your life (by somehow filling a so-called “need”)? What a fucking joke.


About coolchildfreeguy

Childfree guy living in Mexico City. Professional pilot by day, all-around fun guy by night.

Posted on October 13, 2014, in Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink. 8 Comments.

  1. Maybe with your pain in your head, there is no joy for you. I think if there is pain, it is proof of the existence for the opposite. I can feel both happiness and pain. None of them are more real or permanent.

  2. WarrenderN@aol.com

    CoolChildfreeGuy, Hi! How are you? I will try to sign into the message boards again sometime soon. I had my 50th birthday yesterday and it was, like most days, boring. Nothing special happened. But I was “relieved’ that I did make it to 50 as it was previously predicted that I would not. I am grateful that I did not have children, I think that is the wisest decision. So though the day was uneventful, I am thankful I did not have children to muck it up even more. And yes, I agree with most of what you have written below. Thanks!

  3. My husband was given up for adoption at birth. He went to an orphanage where they tied him down on his bed when he wouldn’t sit still, they would put an itchy plant all over him when he was bad, and where the only light in his life was one worker who took a special liking to him. He used to have nightmares about the orphanage. He still rocks himself to sleep because nobody rocked him when he was little and he couldn’t move sometimes.
    At 6, he was adopted. But his new mom didn’t like him. She didn’t understand all his weird tendencies or creativity. She unconsciously stepped all over his sensitive nature. Eventually, it got so bad that his new family sent him away to live at a children’s home. Periodically, they would visit, but frequently left in the middle of the night to avoid the “drama” of him crying and trying to get them to stay.
    Even so… he’s an amazing individual, extraordinarily compassionate, has a genius-level IQ, and has helped many kids who, like himself, were rejected and misunderstood.
    If happiness and love actually didn’t exist, pain and heartbreak also wouldn’t exist. Pain and heartbreak would be the norm. That would be the starting level. You only know misery by having experienced some level of happiness.
    Granted, there is a lot of pain and misery in the world. But there is also light. The shadow proves the sunshine.

    • “If happiness and love actually didn’t exist, pain and heartbreak also wouldn’t exist.”

      That’s not necessarily true. Not all things exist in polar opposites.

      • So pain as opposed to normal living? What if normal living is actually pleasure and pain is supposed to be our baseline for what to expect? For example, I know people who are happy that they get to go to school and eat every day. That brings them “pleasure.” Because their baseline is starvation and no hope for any education/future. To most of us in westernized countries, our baseline is school, eating every day, and pretty much doing whatever we want. Even missing a meal brings us pain and misery. 🙂 Does that make sense? Sorry, I’m not thinking as clearly, it’s really late where I am right now. 🙂

      • The thing is there’s an asymmetry between pleasure and pain as proposed by David Benatar. Whereas:

        1) The presence of pain is bad, and
        2) The presence of pleasure is good;
        3) The absence of pain is good even if there is nobody to enjoy that good, but
        4) The absence of pleasure is not bad for those who do not exist and thus cannot experience deprivation.

        Due to this asymmetry, the only way it would be better to exist than to not would be if life was completely and totally pain free. Even if life was 99.99999…% pleasure and 0.000000…01% pain it would still be better never to have existed.

      • Interesting… My initial thoughts:
        1. This is assuming the presence of pain is bad. Sometimes pain can be good. I love medical stuff, and the rule of thumb is: if you’re experiencing pain, your body is trying to tell you: something is wrong! If we never experienced pain, we would have to live in a perfect world. Which, obviously, we don’t. AND, in the psychological sense, my own personal belief (and experience) is that experiencing depression and “mental pain” is also a sign that something is wrong. It’s a warning sign, that something is wrong. Now, in both senses, you can take medication and the pain may go away, but turning off the fire alarm doesn’t douse the flames. There’s still something wrong, and if you don’t address it, you’ll die.
        Also, 3) “The absence of pain is good even if there is nobody to enjoy that good,” ???? I don’t get this one. I’ve heard stuff like it before, but, scientifically and logically, it doesn’t make sense. Pain is a sensory perception. If nobody is around to experience it, IT doesn’t exist. 🙂
        However, if he is referring to the evil in the world (that the absence of evil is good even if nobody is around to experience it), I would say it’s still fuzzy, logically, but that our whole standards of evil/good had to come from an ultimate standard, which can only come from God.
        I say that because, honestly, there’s no real reason people should get married, not steal, not murder, etc, without a sense of morality instilled in us as human beings (being created by God as separate from the animals). In our sense of morality (although we can persecute and dull it), we have God’s standards written on our hearts.

  4. I agree with the above. Benatar’s theorem has basic deficiencies.
    – the definition of good and bad. Totally subjective. Good and bad can be synonyms of desired and undesired, or pleasureable and painful, but those concepts are still dependant by the observer. Duality has no sense unless defined by an omniscient being.
    – the assymetric matrix. Why would abscence or presence of good and bad be good or bad for a non-existent? Non-existent beings would not differentiate unless it has some sort of existence in another realm. Void does not judge. We can, and according our point of veiw, absence of pain might be more valuable for the unborn than presence of pleasure, but that does not imply anything with respect to our lives, since we already exist. It only defines statements to unborn, which is non-existent and thus not so important. It is even impossible to deduce non-existence is better from life, since it would place the observer to another point in a subjective system. As an existent being, I can declare if my life is worth to live or not (considering pain and pleasure), but I cannot say anything about other beings’ pain, pleasure, value of life, furthermore, those concepts are undefined looking from the non-existent realm.

    Benatar might be right about existence being pointless, but has no right to define good, bad, and value of life. He even said a life that has began has more value than a life that has not (thus legitimizing abortion but not murder), so we should look this question from a life-has-began point of view.

    Even if it’s true that it would be better to never have been born, we already were, so considering that is totally pointless. Even Benatar doesn’t suggest anybody to terminate own or other beings’ life. However, it might suggest not to reproduce, which I agree with, but still, it’s subjective to decide. The Earth would be a better place without humans, that might be true, but it’s also an irrevelant fact from our point of view. As a non-existent, there would be no benefits of a better planet. As an extinct race, we would have nothing to consider good or bad.

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